Finnish symphonic metal giants NIGHTWISH are celebrating three decades of music, storytelling, and world-building with “The Greatest 30 Years on Earth,” a special anniversary release to mark the band’s remarkable journey. From their humble beginnings around a campfire in Kitee to becoming one of the most influential names in symphonic metal, NIGHTWISH’s story is one of constant evolution, imagination, and a deep love for music. As the band looks back on 30 years while already looking ahead to their eleventh studio album, we caught up with mastermind Tuomas Holopainen to reflect on the journey so far, the stories and universe behind NIGHTWISH, the importance of self-irony, his creative process, and what the future might hold. Watch the interview here or read the complete transcript below…
Hi there, and thank you so much for taking the time today to do these interviews. Congratulations on 30 years of NIGHTWISH, feels like a big milestone. How have you been in the last few months since we spoke last?
Been great; life is filled with music of different sorts. After we finished doing the “Yesterwynde” album, we did another AURI album, “Candles and Beginnings,” and that was followed by our first tour ever in Finland and Europe, which was lovely. One of the best tours I’ve ever done. And after that, I’ve been working on my second solo album, which has now actually been recorded. We’re just waiting for the orchestrations to come together, record those, and then mix, and it should be released at some point next year. And at the same time, I have been writing songs for the next NIGHTWISH album. We are entering the studio next year at some point and go from there. So lots of music all around. And of course, this upcoming 30th anniversary release as well.
You’ve had a little hiatus with NIGHTWISH. Has that been necessary for you to create all that music, especially, for instance, the solo record coming and the new NIGHTWISH record? Was it good for you to take a little break from touring so intensively?
It most certainly was. It was the only option, and I can really feel it now because the new songs, they’re just flowing in the most lovely way. I mean, every time I start to write, things come out really easily, and I’m super hyped about everything I’ve seen in daylight so far. That’s good to hear.
30 years ago, you started NIGHTWISH. So I’m wondering about the time that led up to that. So you’re obviously a musician, but I feel like, at least to me, you’re also kind of a storyteller. So that side of you, was that something as a child you always had in you, or is that something you developed?
Always loved stories, imagination, fantastical things. And that’s what I’ve always wanted to do in NIGHTWISH: to tell stories, whether personal or not so personal, and share them first with the band and then with the whole world. That’s the part of this whole thing that I enjoy the most: excavating those stories that I want to tell and then doing our best to bring them alive through music. I just love that whole process. Playing live is a lot of fun as well when things are okay, but I think I feel most at home sitting in front of my keyboard and creating songs.
Was there, in your childhood a spark or something that led you to that?
I think Disney is to blame for that. I’ve been a huge fan since I was three years old, when my parents ordered me the Donald Duck comic. I learned to read from that comic, and then everything Disney kind of shaped me into who I am. I think it’s the biggest reason why I am the way I am, besides my family. That love has stayed there to this day. At some point, The Lord of the Rings came. I read it for the first time when I was 8 or 9 years old. Entered a kingdom I never left. So yes, everything fantastical, everything storytelling has always been there. That’s a big part of my life.
In the early days, you also sang on a few tracks. I was wondering, because you stepped away from singing, obviously, looking back, are there things you experimented with during the early days that you also stepped away from that are not singing?
Everything we ever did with NIGHTWISH was there for a reason, and it was inspired by things that we wanted to bring out to the world. So no, not really. And to come to your point, I actually sing one song on the upcoming solo album. So there’s that. It was just the subject matter of that song and the lyrics; I just couldn’t see anybody else singing them. So I gave it a shot. My wife, Johanna, recorded them, and she said it sounds good enough.
[laughs] Good enough?
[laughter] Yeah, it’s funny to call it a solo album, because there are about 120 other people on that album. But it is what it is.
Is it like some sort of an AYREON project? Do you know what AYREON is?
I don’t.
Oh, AYREON is a Dutch progressive metal project.
Oh, sorry, of course I know them. No, it’s in the same vein as the first solo album, but there’s a huge orchestra and a choir again, lots of guest singers and such.
Is it also about a duck or a different fictional character? [laughs]
Not this time.
Okay, shame. So you’re releasing a special box set and earbook to celebrate the 30th anniversary, and the press release that I received also referenced that there’s an interview about a night in Kitee when you and Empu essentially laid the foundations of Nightwish. So I’m wondering, when you look back at that night specifically, is there anything that stands out in your memories, or was it like a night with alcohol that you don’t really remember?
I do remember it, and there’s a marking in the guest book of our cabin from that day, the 6th of July 1996. And there are names in there, and it doesn’t say anything about forming a band, but I do remember that night we were sitting by a campfire, and I said to the guys that I had this idea of forming a project band. And it wasn’t called NIGHTWISH back then, just an idea of a new band, and that’s how it all started. So nothing but warm memories. Who could have guessed what happened in the years to come?
Well, speaking about campfires, maybe that’s a good time for this question… I was wondering if, for instance, you strip away everything, you only have a guitar, and you’re just sitting around a campfire with a guitar, which NIGHTWISH song or songs would you play for people?
I believe most of the songs that we have done could be arranged for just an acoustic guitar. But which ones? Well, we have played acoustic versions of “Nemo” and “How’s the Heart,” and “Our Decades in the Sun,” for example, in the shows. To answer your question, I think almost any song, save maybe for “Ghost Love Score” or “The Greatest Show on Earth”; those big epics couldn’t be translated into acoustic.
Now, the box set also includes a documentary where it said that it’s showing your creativity, simplicity, love for music, and self-irony. I was wondering, in the music business, do you think self-irony is kind of necessary to stay grounded or to survive in general?
Yeah, it’s vital. I mean, you have to find the right balance between taking music really seriously, as we do when we write the songs, record them, play them live. But you can never take yourself too seriously. You have to be able to laugh at yourself, at the music, the bigness of it, everything. And I think throughout the years, NIGHTWISH has always been able to find that balance.
Is there a moment when you look back on your career that now that you think about it, it’s kind of absurd and makes you laugh, but back then it was like a big deal or something like that? Or all of it, maybe. [laughter]
There are a few songs in the earlier albums that put a big smile on my face these days. And I wouldn’t dream of doing anything like that anymore. But back then, it was the real thing. It’s what we wanted to do. And I had to get them out of my system. So everything’s always made with the real intent. And it’s always been very honest. But maybe songs like “Nymphomaniac Fantasia” or the lyrics of “Elvenpath” are something I wouldn’t go back to these days anymore.
Obviously, you had to learn to compose music and write lyrics. If I, for instance, look at some of my art from when I was a child, I feel a bit like awkward about it. Is that something you have when you listen to the earlier albums? Or are you quite proud?
Not awkward. I just feel amused. Because I can still hear how honest it was. And in many ways, I even miss the little kid who wrote those songs. Mostly not. I’m in a much better place these days than 30 years ago. So no, they are still very dear children to me. I wouldn’t put any song or album above another.
Do you feel like you changed a lot as a person?
In some ways, yes. In many ways, not at all. The childlike enthusiasm is still there when writing songs. I get equally excited when I find a new story to tell and the perfect melody to accompany it. But the years have taught you a lot of things as well. And what better way to learn than doing mistakes? And there are plenty of those. But the thing is that you need to learn, forgive yourself, apologize, and move forward. Because that’s what life is. Doing better next time.
There must be some moments that you had in these 30 years that you now think like, oh, I could have done so much better as like a person.
Of course. But that applies to every single human being who’s ever lived.
Hopefully! NIGHTWISH has gone through different eras. And now that you guys aren’t touring anymore, some of the previous members, like Tarja, Annette, or Marko, are also performing some NIGHTWISH songs during their own live sets. There’s a certain timelessness about your songs. How do you feel about that?
I don’t mind at all, if that’s what you’re asking. I mean, everybody’s free to perform our songs. And it’s just flattering that we have been able to create something that people do on their own as well. It’s a funny thought, though, that we were just touring with AURI, which has 50% of the NIGHTWISH members in it. And we never did any NIGHTWISH songs.
You also probably never even thought about doing a NIGHTWISH song with AURI.
No, it didn’t even cross our minds. We have our own good songs to play.
I don’t know when the new Nightwish album was written, but do you feel like going back to AURI, going out on tour, doing some different types of shows, was that inspiring to you in general to write new music?
It’s been very, very inspiring the past few months. Maybe it has to do with the lovely tour we did with AURI. It definitely has to do with the fact that we have been on a break from NIGHTWISH. Many different things, but for the past few months, I’ve just felt happier than ever before writing new NIGHTWISH songs and my solo as well. So it’s been very fruitful, so to say.
I was happy enough to see you maybe 2 or 3 times with AURI; I don’t remember. But I feel like you were smiling a lot more on stage than during the last few shows with NIGHTWISH. But maybe that’s also a type of music. Do you feel joy again in performing live?
Yeah, with AURI, the group was so harmonious between the band members, the session musicians, the crew, everybody. It just put a big smile on my face, how carefree life can be.
I think we talked about this before, but there’s something I think that’s fun about music is that even if you write about kind of personal things, it becomes kind of universal in a way. Do you feel like letting go of what the song is really about for you and accepting that people would attach their own memories to it is important to you?
That’s the essence of all art. It’s vital. It’s really important. I mean, that’s why I don’t want to go too deep into the lyrics. They always have a very special meaning for me. And they come from a place that has touched me deeply. But it’s so important that people apply their own stories to those lyrics and to that music and make it their own. But that is truly the beauty of all art.
Is there a specific song that you think has been interpreted the most, that is so different from how you actually wrote it?
The first song that comes to mind is “Dead Boy’s Poem” from the album “Wishmaster.” I’ve heard so many different interpretations of what the song is about. And it’s about something very specific to me personally. And it’s just lovely to hear that people have taken it as their own and applied their own story to it. That’s how it should go.
You spent a huge part of your life creating this NIGHTWISH universe. So do you feel like your relationship with that kind of universe has changed now that you’ve grown older?
No, I’m still really giddy about it. Yeah, it’s a lovely sandbox to play in. This whole Nightwish universe. 30 years of it, 10 albums of it, and more to come.
How do you think the 11th NIGHTWISH album will be different?
I have 7 songs done so far, but it’s far too early to say anything because they’re still so raw. But again, I already know that it’s gonna be something… Something similar and something different, as always before.
You’ve drawn a lot of inspiration from different sides of the world, literature, music, nature, film. But do you feel like there are some stories you still want to tell that you haven’t explored yet?
Countless of them. I mean, if there weren’t, I wouldn’t be doing this anymore. I would start to do something else. But the world is changing. The cosmos is such a fantastical place full of stories and emotions that can be transferred into a wonderful song. And that’s a process that I want to continue exploring as long as I live, basically.
What do you think is, for instance, if you take Ozzy Osbourne, he obviously couldn’t perform anymore, but it was his wish that before he died, he would say goodbye to the fans with one more show. Do you think that you are like that as well? That you will play until it’s physically not possible anymore? Or when is it time to stop?
When it’s time to stop, when you start producing crap. I hope I have enough sense left at that point, or somebody around me tells me that, okay, time has come.
Do you think people would tell you that though?
I hope so. At least the people I love and am close to, yeah.
Yeah, so quitting on a sort of high note, I guess, still is the best way for you.
Yeah, as long as it gives you more than it takes. As long as it feels comfortable for me. I really couldn’t see living without doing songs, writing stories, even if it was only for myself and nobody else will ever hear them. I would still continue writing.
Do you have songs like that that will never see the light of day?
Maybe.
Well, we’ll never know. So kind of like Schrodinger’s cat. If you could give your 30-year-younger self some advice, what would you give them?
I go back to this idea once more that what life is about is doing better next time. And I wouldn’t do anything differently because everything that we have done for the past 30 years has taken us to this moment and this place, which is absolutely wonderful. I’ve never been happier than at this stage of my life. So if I were to change anything in the past, you might have the butterfly effect, and things could go wrong. So I really wouldn’t change anything.
What do you think you would have done if you hadn’t become a musician? Would you have liked to work in film?
Well, my childhood dream was to become a biologist, like a researcher in the oceans or something like that. So I would probably be doing that or be a writer, like an author.
When the CHILDREN OF BODOM guys decided to stop, some of them went back to university. Is that something you missed in your lifetime? Not being able to study biology?
No, it hasn’t, because it’s still a part of my everyday life. I follow natural sciences all the time, and they are and have been of great inspiration for the music we write as well. So it’s a nice little marriage there.
Was it Floor who had some kind of a bug or something called after her? I don’t remember.
She has one, yeah, and I have one as well.
You have one as well?
Yeah. What a great honor that is.
Do you know why people do things like that, name a bug after you? Is it because the person who found it was such a big fan?
I think it’s a combination of maybe being a fan and the fact that we have been promoting the love of natural sciences through our, especially, 3 latest albums. So maybe that’s why.
You mentioned in our previous interview that the natural science themes were concluded in the last album. I’m assuming that you are still keeping in touch with the subject somehow.
Yeah, because it’s so interesting and it’s vital that we at least try to understand how the world works.
Is it going to be difficult for you to step away from that theme?
Let’s see what the next album brings.
This is maybe a very broad question, but… After 30 years, NIGHTWISH has obviously become bigger than it was before. But if you strip everything away, like the record-selling, all the gold records and whatnot, what does NIGHTWISH mean to you today?
NIGHTWISH is a state of mind. It’s a way of life that I share with like-minded people, people that I adore. And it’s also a way for me to do something meaningful and leave a mark on this planet. And it’s also a way of me keeping myself sane, trying to make sense of who I am, trying to make sense of the world. I get to do what I love with the people that I love from a place where I want to live and make a living out of it and make a change as well. What more could you want? So I’m in a really, really happy place.
