Despite rehearsals for the upcoming AYREON shows, Arjen Lucassen has released a new solo album, “Songs No One Will Hear.” In our conversation, he spoke about drawing inspiration from classics like Jeff Wayne’s “War of the Worlds” and Jesus Christ Superstar, why he embraced his own voice for most of the record, and how he balances playful moments with heavier themes like humanity facing its end. Watch the complete interview here or read the transcript below…
Hi again, and thank you so much for taking the time to do this interview.
Always, always. Always a pleasure.
I don’t remember when we last spoke. To be fair, I may have skipped a release. Sorry for that. But how have you been meanwhile?
Busy, always busy. I don’t remember either which album it was, because I’ve released so many. I think after the last AYREON album, I released five more albums. So I keep myself busy.
I don’t know how you do it, because I thought with the upcoming AYREON shows that would have kept you busy enough, but somehow you managed to squeeze out this record as well.
The thing was that while I was working on the album, we thought, wouldn’t it be cool if we could sell it at the AYREON shows?
Oh, yeah.
So I had to speed it up at some point. I thought, okay, maybe I can be ready for the AYREON shows. And then I got inspiration, because I started thinking about them immediately after the previous shows were over. Two years ago I already picked the songs and invited the singers, so most of the work was done. Usually about a year before, we start working on production meetings and all that, but I have a team who does the dirty work, so I can do the fun work and work on albums.
Yeah. Although you do have the AYREON “band” rehearsals, right?
Once a month, yeah. We had about six months of rehearsals, maybe eight or nine total. I think we’ve done five now, so we’ve played the whole set already. In the next rehearsals, the backing singers and classical instruments will join. But that’s just once a month.
Well, one month to go!
Yep.
Anyway, you’re releasing a new solo album, and I don’t remember if this was during our interviews or others, but I do recall Jeff Wayne’s name coming up. He’s a huge inspiration, and I couldn’t help but draw some parallels between “Songs No One Will Hear” and “War of the Worlds.” Is this your own “War of the Worlds“?
I think every album I do is my own “War of the Worlds.” Because of that album, I wanted to use a narrator—Richard Burton was so amazing. A narrator really draws you into the story. Some people find narration annoying, but for me it’s part of the experience. I’m not the kind of guy who makes a Spotify list and listens to single songs. I’m still old-fashioned and listen to the whole album. That’s what “War of the Worlds” did—you became part of the story. That’s what I try to do. That’s why I say every album I make is my “War of the Worlds” or my Jesus Christ Superstar.
Yeah, I noticed something that reminded me of Jesus Christ Superstar as well. That musical has the crazy “King Herod’s Song,” and I felt like “Shaggathon” had a similar vibe.
“Walk Across My Swimming Pool,” you mean that one?
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah. [starts singing] “So, you are the Christ, you’re the great Jesus Christ.” Could be, yeah. Other people don’t like those songs, but I love them. I’ve always loved the weird songs. Like QUEEN’s “Lazy on a Sunday Afternoon.” People say they don’t like them—I do. It’s got a QUEEN feel, maybe a bit of BEATLES or ELO. It’s definitely the weird song out on the album.
Yeah, for me it had the same vibe as “King Herod’s Song.” It’s a heavy album thematically, and that song lightened up the mood. Did you think it was important to have something like that?
Very much. I always start with the music and hope it inspires the story. I tell you this every time, probably. This time the music was very eclectic—some happy songs, some very sad songs—so I needed a concept to reflect that. I always write about human emotions, so I thought, what if people knew they only had five months to live? What would they do with their lives? Everyone would do something different. That gave me a lot of space. Then, of course, I had to find a way to exterminate humanity once again—it’s my favorite hobby. I didn’t want it too political, with wars and such, which is tempting these days where there is a lot of misery going on, but I don’t want to do that, I don’t think it’s my place as a musician, so I picked the asteroid once again.
You also decided to release this as a solo album. Is that a nod to Jeff Wayne? Or why did you decide not to make it part of the AYREON universe, even though it would have fit?
It would have fit if there were more characters. This is a concept album, but not a rock opera. I think it becomes a rock opera when you have at least ten characters and different singers. The last couple of years I did too many albums for other people—Simone [Simons], PLAN 9 for Robert—so it was time to do something selfish. Most of all, I love to sing. People think I hate my voice, but I actually like the sound of it. I just don’t have the technique. But by now I know my limits and can write for myself in a way that it sounds good. The fact that I sing about 80 percent of the songs makes it a solo album.
Yeah, you’ve mentioned before that you don’t see yourself as a good singer, even during shows. But on this record, I think you outdid yourself. Did you do anything special to prepare—like vocal coaching?
No, I don’t think vocal coaching would help me. That works more for operatic or powerful singers. What I found is that the softer I sing, the better it is. If I don’t force myself, don’t try to sing too high, and if I really sing softly, then I can even manage a vibrato. I never had that before—just a fast little vibrato that was pretty much out of tune. But if I sing softly and in a certain key, I can make it sound good. So finally, at my old age, I’m learning to sing a little.
Is that something you’d like to explore more now that you’ve found what works for your voice?
Definitely. This won’t be my last solo album, at least I hope not, because I really enjoy it. I can do it whenever I want. I can do it whenever I feel good. I have my own studio at home, so I don’t need to prepare or pick up singers from the airport. I can just go in whenever I want, and redo things as often as I want. If I hear it the next day and think, I can do better, I redo it—no problem. I might even sing on the next AYREON again, because I didn’t really sing on the last couple of albums.
Yeah, that’s true. Do you get nervous singing during the shows? Last time you did two songs.
It’s terrible. Because the best singers in the world are on stage—Anneke, Floor, Russell Allen—and then there I am with my little voice. I know people enjoy it because I come on with a big smile and joke around, but it’s still very scary. And these next shows—we’ve got Dino Jelusick, one of the best singers in the world right now in his style. He’s going to hear me sing. That’s scary.
So there’s going to be a song with you on vocals then.
Oh, shit, you got me. Yes, there is.
Okay. Well, spoiler alert. Sorry for the fans. Going back to the album—I read that Mike Mills wrote and performed all the narrations. How much freedom did you give him?
Oh, you have to give Mike freedom. He’s the best, and the last thing I’d want is to limit him. I just told him what the songs and the concept were about. I also told him it was important to balance humor with seriousness. On a song like “We’ll Never Know,” he had to be serious—no jokes there. I had a few specific lines, like “Ragged clothed,” or the Monty Python quote “Always Look on the Bright Side,” but 80 to 90 percent of the text is his.
The nod to “Everybody Dies”—would you say this album grew out of that song, or was it just a fun Easter egg?
Just an Easter egg, but there are definitely references. That song was happy-sounding but with sad lyrics—everybody dies. That comes back here too, in a concept about the end of the world. In “Shaggathon” you’re singing about a big world orgy, but in “Everybody Dies” it wasn’t an asteroid people there, so it is different.
You mentioned “Always Look on the Bright Side of Life.” How much are you inspired by Monty Python?
Hugely. I love it so much. Best humor ever. Actually, this is also a spoiler—I re-recorded a song from my first solo album, which will be re-released on September 12th. It’s a cheesy lyric about knights, and I put seven Monty Python references in the video. That will be released in a few weeks. Let’s see if people recognize them.
Are there going to be coconuts in there?
Yes.
That’s awesome.
Yes. Coconuts will be in there.
Is that why there’s always humor in your work, even when most of it is serious? Does it come from Monty Python?
Definitely Monty Python, and also the Bonzo Dog Band, who were closely related to them. “The Knights of the Coconuts” actually came from Neil Innes, the Bonzo Dog Band’s singer. I’ve always loved humor in music—like Frank Zappa too. He had some very naughty lyrics, surprisingly got away with it, and that spirit returns in “Shaggathon.”
I like when it’s not all too dark. Even on “Electric Castle,” which is pretty dark, you still have the Hippie character lightening the mood with “Hey Dude, You’re so Uncool.” I like to do that. It also ties into this album’s concept—if you have only five months to live, try to make the best of it. We’re all going to die, just not today—which is also one of the tracks.
There’s a lesson in there: enjoy life.
It’s a very simple Carpe Diem.
When you work with humor in music, do you find it difficult?
Actually, the opposite. I have to hold back. Humor and science fiction are tricky in music—they’re often seen as cheesy. If you put them in a movie, suddenly it’s a blockbuster. But in music, it’s risky.
Did you scrap any ideas from this album because of that?
No, I think the balance is good here. Of course you’ve got “Shaggathon,” and “Goddamn Conspiracy,” which is semi-humorous—it pokes fun at conspiracy theories. I hope I don’t get in trouble with people for that. You know, the Flat Earth Society says they have members all over the globe…
I was also wondering, if you had only five months to live, what would you do?
The story is about Sanctuary Island, where the asteroid will hit Earth. I brought back Dr. Slumber, a character from “Lost in the New Real.” There he had a euthanasia home—again, humor. He returns in this story and arranges a bus tour to Sanctuary Island for front-row seats to the asteroid coming down. I would be there. I wouldn’t want to be on the other side of the world, slowly dying from tsunamis, wars, famine. If I can’t live like I do now, I’d rather be on Sanctuary Island. I see it like a hippie commune—everyone on the beach, holding hands, singing, and then, whoosh, here comes the asteroid. Let it land on my head. No pain, no suffering. So yeah, I’d try to get to Sanctuary Island.
Sorry if that’s personal, but is death something that scares you?
Not really. Disease scares me—losing the ability to do things. But death itself, no. I just hope the end is the end. Eternity scares me more. Imagine continuing forever—forever is a long time. Thinking about that drives me crazy. I really hope it’s just “end of story.”
The last song is called “The Final Song.” If the world really ended in five months, what would your dream last song be?
Every song I write is the most important thing in the world for me. Right now I’m working on my next album, and the last idea I recorded on my phone feels like the most important song I’ve ever written. Next week it will be the next one. I’m a perfectionist and very competitive. So honestly, it goes for every song.
Would you say every song you’ve released feels perfect to you, or are there ones you regret?
I regret a lot of them, especially pre-AYREON songs. I was 35 when I started AYREON. Before that, I did silly stuff. With VENGEANCE, we had lyrics like “I saw a beautiful blonde and a pretty brunette, come on girls, let’s get wet.” Did I really write that? But then you work for a band. On my first solo album, which will also be re-released in September, I had silly country songs like “On the Midnight Train” and “Country Girl, City Boy.” At the time, I thought it was great. You can’t always be objective about your own stuff. It takes a while.
Do you feel like looking back has taught you lessons?
Of course. You learn from everything, most of all from your mistakes. Once I started AYREON though, if I listen back now, I’m proud of every album. Sometimes I even get scared—can I ever top that? Did I already do everything? How am I going to come up with something new, because I’ve made albums for 45 years.
Apart from the AYREON shows, what’s next for you? Are you working on new AYREON material?
The thing is, I did so many side projects since the last AYREON that I think people are getting a bit tired of it. It’s like, “Hey, I’ve got this new album, “Supersonic Revolution,” it’s about the seventies,” and people go, “Yeah, but when are you going to do the next AYREON?” So I really think it’s time now to work on the new AYREON. And again, it’s scary—what am I going to do? I already did everything. Even if I come up with a riff, I wonder, did I already do this before? On one side I’m getting better, learning from the past, but on the other side it’s getting harder because I’ve already done so much. So I have to find a balance there.
Well, with AYREON, you can always bring in new people to keep it fresh.
True. I can keep it young. That’s the luxury of AYREON. I can bring in new talent and keep it young.
I think that’s pretty much it for my questions. Do you have any last thoughts you want to share with your fans?
Just curious what your favorite song is.
Oh—probably “Goddamn Conspiracy,” but I also really liked “Shaggathon.”
Okay. Well, “Goddamn Conspiracy” is actually being released tomorrow as a video clip. All the musicians are in it, and I’m very curious about people’s reactions. So far, the feedback are above expectations, which is good, because I’m always insecure at this stage. Anyway, I just hope everyone lets me know what they think. I not only learn from my own music, but also from people’s reactions. I’m just guessing what they might like.
Yeah and at least you react to all comments!
And I try to respond to comments, because if people take time to comment on my music, I think it’s only fair that I reply. I learn from that, so keep on doing that!
Interview by Laureline Tilkin
